Anthony Killeen (00:00)
Today on the Revenue Acceleration Podcast, my special guest is Raghav Narayan.
Raghav is the co-founder of a company called Aprisium. Raghav, welcome to the show. Thank you for joining us. Please tell us a little bit about yourself and your company and what you guys do.
RAGHAV NARAYAN (00:13)
Hi, Anthony. Thank you for having me. My name is Raghav Narayan, as you said. I'm the founder and CEO of Aprisium, a Singapore-based deep tech company. We focus on real-time autonomous contamination monitoring. Our mission is very simple, detect pollution at the source. Why? Simply because you want to detect it before it becomes a crisis. We help industries, utilities, and governments currently across Asia and also Europe make water safer.
treatment more efficient and operations more sustainable. Sort of think of us as the intelligence and the eyes behind smarter environmental decisions.
Anthony Killeen (00:46)
that sounds very interesting. tell us a little bit about your background. How did you start or why did you start Aprisium and tell us where you guys are heading.
RAGHAV NARAYAN (00:55)
Yeah, thank you. Absolutely. After almost 25 years in corporate life all around the globe in technology and automotive industries, right, and leading industry, leading global roles, what I saw firsthand were the problems with contamination and companies were paying millions of dollars in fines and penalties. So sort of
Anthony Killeen (01:13)
okay.
RAGHAV NARAYAN (01:16)
I wanted to address this, but also build something meaningful, scalable, impactful, sort of a for-profit company which can address this, but also build a good environmental conglomerate. So sort of EPRESEM came out of that sense of goal and urgency. So the thing is delayed pollution, right? Detection not only leads to fines and penalties. We discussed that. More important results in irreversible damage.
from groundwater contamination to unnecessary chemical use, actually most often we overuse chemicals in treatment systems. And there weren't really tools available that offered continuous autonomous monitoring at the source, at the site level. So there we are, we created APRICIUM, we combined industrial Internet of Things, IOT, electrochemistry and AI to give stakeholders real-time visibility into what was really happening in the water system.
and that's how Pritium was born.
Anthony Killeen (02:08)
Right, okay, interesting. So basically companies that have any water waste, previously before you guys would have to get someone in, get a testing sample, they'd take it to the lab and take weeks at a time to then come back and tell them, your water's contaminated, you need to do this. And in the meantime, they could be getting fines from the local governments.
RAGHAV NARAYAN (02:28)
Bingo, exactly. You hit the nail on the head. Fundamentally, yes. Almost all big players take samples. know, they're constant lugging of samples to their lab, sending it across, getting it tagged, bringing it back. And you get a simple report which doesn't say anything about, you know, what's the trend? What exactly are contributing to these pollutants? It's just a bunch of list of pollutants with concentration in red and green and amber.
It doesn't help much in decision making. It just tells you how bad or how good it is, or what. But then where we come in is really continuously measured. So not only are you seeing actual contamination at source, real time, you're also seeing the trends and where it is headed. You can not only see velocity, for example, of either it's building or also acceleration. How fast is it building up the contamination? And sort of using our AI, we're able to profile the contaminants and start to see what is causing
Anthony Killeen (03:09)
Alright.
RAGHAV NARAYAN (03:19)
these kind of contaminants to grow? Why is certain contaminants growing and not others? And what could be potential possible reasons in the process which is contributing to these contaminants? So the wealth of information available by so much of data and using an algorithm is so immense that that's how we've had pretty early traction with our solution. And I think that's primarily driven because of the fact that there was such an urgent need in the market and sort of we sort of hit the iron miller process.
Quite getting hot.
Anthony Killeen (03:48)
That sounds great. basically now companies if they get you guys to work with them, they'll have real time monitoring set up within their offices so they can see on a minute by minute basis what their their wastewater contaminant looks like and be able to get in front of any trouble that might be coming up down the track and save hundreds of thousands or millions of dollars in fines.
RAGHAV NARAYAN (04:09)
Precisely. So they get these alerts right on the dashboard. They can sit in the cozy offices and see how the contamination landscape is progressing. And apart from the fact that they can get it on a dashboard where they can take decisions, we also provide alerts. We can create threshold levels and say, this is your amber zone. This is your red zone. And the moment it hits the amber zone, the operational level people get an update.
If it goes into a red zone, then the big bosses get the update, because that's when the penalties are going to start hitting in, kicking in. So then they get alert as well. So it's all decided by the customers, how they want the alerting system. You can also integrate the whole treatment as well. For example, if it gets into amber zone, you can already automate the treatment so that customers don't have to wait for someone to go actually adjust something to manage the treatment. So all of this can be integrated. So we have full technology stack end-to-end so that we can deliver not only alerts.
Anthony Killeen (04:52)
okay.
RAGHAV NARAYAN (05:00)
but also automation into their treatment plan. And all of this comes with, apart from saving millions of dollars in fines and so on, you're actually getting ahead of the problem. You are already seeing what's happening and taking action before it becomes a crisis, before it hits the red moon, right? That's where we come in. So very interesting and very interesting for customers as well. But yeah, we're still growing. We are a startup, but extremely, extremely
Anthony Killeen (05:15)
was fantastic.
RAGHAV NARAYAN (05:23)
extreme interest from customers from almost all walks of life. And we can talk about that more as we progress in this.
Anthony Killeen (05:29)
Yeah, for sure. That's great. Fantastic. So, you know, most of the people that might be watching or that we deal with, they're starting out in business or they're in a position where they're wanting to grow. Can you tell us a little bit how you got your first clients? You've already said that there was really good traction immediately with your product. How did you get those first couple of clients?
RAGHAV NARAYAN (05:46)
Absolutely. So as I said, right, early clients came through sheer relevance. They saw the value. But of course, there's always skepticism. To work with a startup who's almost claiming that they can do real time while all their lives they've been sending it to a lab, of course, comes with a bunch of skepticism, right? But I think where it came was the fact that we not only talked about sustainability, we also talked about saving costs.
I think the early customers, the early adopters, even though they embraced the idea of addressing some of the contamination challenges, I think what attracted them was the fact that they could actually save money while it was important to be sustainable and manage the pollution, but also it was important to save costs. So we very early proved that sustainability need not be at the cost of profitability, right? In fact, what's good for the environment is also good for business. So that's how, that's the message we created. Sure persistence, of course.
And this message hit some of the customers, some of the earlier doctors. We're very happy with some of earlier doctors. And they came in with projects in... Our earliest customer actually was in data center. And then, which is something we hadn't even envisaged when we began our business. And we were looking at more like drinking water and wastewater. And a data center customer was the first one who came and said, hey, we're interested in your thing. We came across something we read about you. What is it that you can do? And then we got into a discussion with them.
Anthony Killeen (06:53)
Yeah.
RAGHAV NARAYAN (07:02)
and they realized that they're saving already hundreds of thousands of dollars using our solution. It was initially a small pilot and then it became a proper commercial contract. And once we started there, there was no looking back. Then we started getting into drinking water. We started getting into aquaculture and then wastewater. So it sort of started to build from there. A big breakthrough happened when we got into food. Food is such a huge industry for us because most food industries lose billions of dollars because of contamination.
in the food. And for them, found very attractive proposition to install real-time contamination and pollution monitoring devices. So I would say that once the clients started to see the real value, for example, we started to reduce fish mortality in aquaculture, food industries where there was so much wastage, we addressed that, then a lot of customers converted quickly. I think one of the lessons I have learned personally is
talk savings, talk value and not just stand on a high horse and say, let's go and address sustainability. I think everybody is here to save a dollar here or save a dollar there. So I think we should be prepared to be persistent about the savings and costs and also give the bigger picture about sustainability, you know, educate the the whole package.
and not just selling doesn't help. It's a thought leadership. It's talking about savings and sustainability and a few. The customers need to feel that they're sort of striking a few birds with one stone. I think that's what...
Anthony Killeen (08:25)
Yeah, yeah, for sure.
Yeah, sounds like you did a great job with the messaging. So how was that initial outreach done? Did you release some ads or was it through your network of people you knew or how did you go about starting to talk with these businesses?
RAGHAV NARAYAN (08:38)
So it's a combination of factors. First and foremost, the fact that we founders are not the youngest people in town, we come with 25, 30 years of experience. There is a bit of respect for the gray hair. They know that we've seen it all, done it all. I think that helps. That helps. know that we've sort of been through the grind. I think that was the initial door opener. But then once the door is open, I think that's when the credibility we need to build very quickly. I think we talked about piloting.
Anthony Killeen (08:49)
Yeah.
So.
RAGHAV NARAYAN (09:03)
Fundamentally, I think it's word of mouth. The initial customers need to really open up doors for the rest of them. And then we did do some pilots. What we insisted on paid pilots because I've learned from experience that anything free is never understood, never recognized. Even get a dollar or two, there is a recognition in the company that these guys are selling value and not just giving it away free. Despite the fact we're well funded,
Anthony Killeen (09:25)
go. ⁓
RAGHAV NARAYAN (09:27)
I was not a big fan of giving anything free. Nobody respects anything free. So then, course, even a small dollar skin in the game makes them sit up and notice and see how it's working. And then they're really seeing the value, right? So I would say initially, doors open by word of mouth, network, contacts. Then they're to talk to us, looking at the fact that we've sort of got some experience. We're not talking through our hats. And then once you get a foothold in the door,
We, course, sell value, show them all the benefits, cost savings and so on, and do a pilot for a very nominal cost. And then once the value is shown, I think then the message spreads to word of mouth. We didn't do any of the conventional marketing, digital marketing on. Digital marketing or performance marketing, these are 100 % B2B. And B2B works through word of mouth, respect, network and so on. So I think that's how it is. Of course, we do more into events, exhibitions.
Anthony Killeen (10:16)
So.
RAGHAV NARAYAN (10:21)
podcasts and webinars and so on but initially it was more through word of mouth and networking and respect.
Anthony Killeen (10:28)
great, thanks for sharing that. So you mentioned a couple of different type of target markets that you guys have, and one of them wasn't really intended, the data centers, that's definitely something that I wouldn't have thought of straight away when I thought of wastewater. So how the data center is using water, it's obviously for cooling, is that right?
RAGHAV NARAYAN (10:45)
Yeah, absolutely. So any industry which uses water, virtual needs a solution. So data center was very fascinating development for us. So oftentimes data centers use water for cooling the data centers, fresh water. And what happens is, based on the contamination of the water, the water is not very effective in exchanging heat. So water is obviously used to exchange heat between data centers and the atmosphere. And if the water is contaminated, obviously the
heat is not exchanged properly and also the water is not cool enough in the the in fountains in the in the tower because there are hardness scales, hardness corrosion causing substances in the water which are clogging the pipes and then the heat exchange is not effective. So one of the very key parameters for data centers is to monitor water continuously and then do the treatment for the water based on the contaminants. Otherwise it's a general one size fits all treatment which is based on what
someone sends a water sample to a lab three months back, and then the whole treatment protocol is based on a one-off test sent to a lab. And that's not really effective because water changes its characteristics almost by the minute, by the hour. And you cannot have one single treatment plan. So that's where we come in. Then we started to deliver solutions, and then it blossomed into a very good opportunity. We showed them how we can save not only chemicals for treatment, but also energy. Because the more you cool,
If the water is contaminated, have to use more energy to cool the water. The fans have to run faster. then you're saving. So by using a better quality of water, you're saving energy. And more importantly, you are reducing the maintenance costs, be it scaling, corrosion, and so on and so forth. And last but not the least, your data centers are always running efficiently. Otherwise, they overheat, it closes down your banks, can't access your banks, and so on and so forth. So it's a lot of little things there as well. So that's how it worked.
Anthony Killeen (12:27)
Yeah.
So
RAGHAV NARAYAN (12:33)
So the other interesting factors, which is a side impact or other byproduct of all this cost savings is the fact that you can reuse the freshwater again and again. A data center typically can use up to a million liters of freshwater. And in most countries where it's stressed for water, this is a very, very unsustainable way of using freshwater. So you can do proper monitoring of water, you reuse the water and increase what we call cycles of concentration.
Anthony Killeen (12:33)
Okay, great.
Yeah.
RAGHAV NARAYAN (12:58)
And that also has a sustainable point of view as well. So we sort of again hit a few birds with one stone.
Anthony Killeen (13:02)
Yeah, for sure.
that's great. So a little bit of a sidetrack from my own interest is, so a data center is set up, they get a source of water that they're using, fresh water. How does the water become contaminated just by cooling down their system? Is it from the machines that pump the water? Is it from the cooling tanks? where does the contaminants come from?
RAGHAV NARAYAN (13:26)
Contaminants are everywhere. Everywhere. I mean, even in a closed loop circuit system, there is lot of bacterial contamination. There is buildup of biofilms in the tubes. It is the way the world works. There is contamination almost everywhere. And in a cooling tower, when you're running the water through those towers, where there is exchange between the air and the water, that is the time where you absorb a lot of bacterial contamination, lot of contamination from the air.
And of course, from when it is running through the tubes, it picks up all the inherent contaminants from the tubes and so on from the biofilm build up, from the chemical build up, it is constantly acquiring contaminants. yeah, so be it aquaculture, be it data centers, be it industry, anywhere where there's water, contamination goes hand in hand. There is no option for the water to go and collect all the bad stuff.
Anthony Killeen (14:04)
Yeah, sure.
RAGHAV NARAYAN (14:15)
and build itself with lot of bad stuff, so contaminants. So that's why any industry which uses water need a solution. And that's also how we initially started. We wanted to be in an industry which is evergreen. There's no seasonality to it. There's no friction to it. We wanted to be in a company which is needed by all. And water is something everybody uses, right? So that's how we started the business as well.
Anthony Killeen (14:29)
Yeah.
So
Okay, great. Thanks for sharing that. So, data centers is obviously a big one for you guys. What other target markets at the moment are you focusing on?
RAGHAV NARAYAN (14:46)
Yeah, absolutely. There's also another thing which we all as founders of startups need to learn, right? Focus, focus, focus. Otherwise, we're trying to do too many things and then we end up drifting all around the place. So we very early on identified three focus areas. One of them is industrial, industrial, which basically means semiconductors, data centers, all industrial use of water. That's the one. Second one is food.
Anthony Killeen (14:54)
Yeah.
Exactly,
RAGHAV NARAYAN (15:11)
Food for us is extremely interesting because food has a lot of contamination and they use a lot of water. And what has to be recycled, the same challenges with data center food, like for example, data centers, I'm sorry, dairy, fruit, fruit juice manufacturing, fruit pulp manufacturing, sauces, all the food industries use a lot of water and they suffer from extreme amount of contamination and wastage. So that's a focus area for us.
The third room which is for the last year we are focusing on is PFAS. PFAS has become such a big issue in the world. PFAS is what we call as forever chemicals. These are complex organic molecules which are in everywhere in our everyday life. You can find it in your firefighting equipment, your anything which is nonstick, which is used to repel water. All of them have PFAS in some way or another.
And these have completely engulfed the environment and there's a huge awareness about it in all the developed markets, Europe, US, Australia, Japan. And there is such a huge focus that a lot of markets are keeping aside billions of dollars to not only monitor and detect and quantify PFAS, but also treat it. It's a separate topic by itself. And the biggest challenge we have with PFAS, because they're called forever chemicals for a reason.
because you can't detect it. It's all over the place and you can't treat it. It's very difficult to treat it, very difficult to detect it. Even in extremely low concentrations that have a very deleterious effect on the human body. So we are detecting concentrations for parts per trillion. And what we did, which is our biggest claim to fame as of today, is one of the very few companies in the world who can detect PFAS at site, at source, without concentration, without sample handling.
to parts per trillion. that's, just filed a patent end of last year. Otherwise the current state of the art is you take a sample, send it to a lab and wait for a couple of months. And the reason it takes so long is because you're taking lots of water and concentrate it because you're detecting two parts per trillion, not even parts a million, parts a billion, the parts per trillion. And that's hugely expensive and complex. So where we come in is to help customers detect it at site to parts per trillion without too much of a hassle on concentration and so on.
So that's our third.
Anthony Killeen (17:17)
Okay, so
what kind of customers are actively monitoring this stuff?
RAGHAV NARAYAN (17:22)
So there's a regulation coming across all over the world. So basically it's the same companies, water treatment companies, semiconductor plants, industrial plants, they have to monitor their water for PFAS before they can discharge. And there are about 30,000 different molecules, but there are seven key regulated molecules as a union set. There are seven molecules. Europe regulates about six, US regulates seven, Australia regulates about four to five, Japan regulates about three.
Anthony Killeen (17:34)
I okay.
RAGHAV NARAYAN (17:49)
but they are a union set of about seven molecules. ⁓ And we can detect these seven molecules in specific specie to each individual molecule to parts per trillion. So yeah, it's the same industries and water treatment companies and so on. So that's what we can do.
Anthony Killeen (17:52)
Okay.
Right, I see.
Well, it sounds like you've got a huge market there. So how are you currently getting new clients then? You've talked about how you initially got your clients. Have you got a program to bring on new clients or is it still just kind of word of mouth at the moment?
RAGHAV NARAYAN (18:17)
It's a completely word of mouth. So PFAS is a very niche segment, only water treatment companies. So there are European regulations now with this new thing called REACH, R-E-A-C-H, where all the water has to be monitored at site and quantified and corrected before it can be discharged. Now this is a huge burden on water treatment companies and industries and so on. So a lot of these companies are trying to figure out a way to monitor and detect at site.
then of course we turn up our website is very clearly there. So they turn up and we have a lot of inquiries coming to us through emails, through word of mouth. In the last three months, I would have had at least 10 to 15 customers from all over Europe and Japan contacting me. So today we have finalized a contract with two Japanese customers who because they're Japanese, highly regulating PFAS. And we just signed a contract yesterday with two Japanese customers for detecting PFAS at site.
We're also working with companies in Europe. We have a lot of companies from the US who are interested in working with us as well for PFAS detection. So, lot of interest, lot of traction, lot of customers talking from all over Europe and US and Australia and Japan talking to us. very interesting time for us from a PFAS detection point.
Anthony Killeen (19:27)
Yeah,
that's great. Really exciting. Fantastic. So you mentioned before that you're already implementing AI with a Aprisium and the product that you provide. So tell us a little bit about that. How does AI work into the product? And also, are you using AI behind the scenes for your business operations as well?
RAGHAV NARAYAN (19:44)
Yeah, lots. I mean, we don't talk much about AI because our whole goal is use contamination detection outside. But a lot of AI goes into our business in so many different areas. know, it's a core part of what we do. So, for example, our analyzers generate millions of data points, a lot of sensor data. So fundamentally, we use the AI right there, one, for correcting for sensor interference.
So obviously when you detect certain contaminants, can be some interference, certain other contaminants mimicking as what we're trying to detect. So we use AI to correct for that and clean up that data. Second, we use AI to start predicting it. It's not just about detecting what's happening there. Customers can only act so much. They need to have some kind of predictive insights. And that's only possible with our machine learning algorithm and our AI, which looks at a series of historical data.
but also takes the independent variables and see the impact of that independent variable. And then we start to predict the contamination trends. That is something very, very interesting for our customers. So these are two areas where we use AI. The third area we use AI is to also use in our dashboarding and reporting formatting, report formats. For example, customers are getting all this data and they need automated reports coming to them every week. So...
different echelons in the organization, they need different kinds of information. So the dashboard, the office level people need real-time data, but a manager needs a much more pre-digested data. And then the CEOs need a very high level profile of how the contamination looks like. So each of these reporting is automated using our AI algorithms, which give us reports automatically every week, every month to the different stakeholders in the organization. So that's the thing we do.
The last thing we use AI internally to also use our AI diagnostics for our maintenance of analyzers. So we do everything over the air, all troubleshooting of analyzers. These are hardware which are kept in remote sites. So it's completely IoT. So we can actually diagnose using our AI on how the various sensors are working, there any issues in the flow, issues in the power, all of this we use AI to help us diagnose and solve the problems as well.
multiple areas we use AI.
Anthony Killeen (21:50)
wow, that's great. And what are your thoughts on AI as a whole? Nearly every business I speak to is using AI in some form or another. So where do you think AI is gonna go? Do you think it's going to start taking jobs? Or do you think it's going to help us leverage into being able to grow quicker and use our actual human side of things to focus on higher level tasks and projects?
RAGHAV NARAYAN (22:11)
Completely. at Aprisium, we don't look at AI as replacing humans. I think what we're looking at AI is to amplifying the accuracy, the speed, and also decision making. I think the future will be completely autonomous and you cannot have people doing menial jobs. It has to be done by AI. But humans are very much in the loop, especially critical infrastructure in decision making.
and also giving value-added services. I think we believe strongly that AI is so crucial for solving so much of problems, and they will, I think, complement the humans in the loop. I think that's the way we look at it. And it's so important, I think. I cannot imagine the kind of insights we deliver to our customers today. I couldn't imagine our life without AI. So it's completely core to what we do today in AI.
Anthony Killeen (22:49)
Yeah.
RAGHAV NARAYAN (23:00)
Personally, I use a lot of AI as well in the way we analyze things and so on. And I think it's so core, so core to our business. I can't even imagine a life without AI. It's just a recent development. I couldn't have imagined a prison without AI. I think we go hand in hand.
Anthony Killeen (23:08)
Yeah
Yeah, yeah,
for sure. that's great. Thank you for that insight. Yeah, I think with that view too, you can really kind of dive into the powerful side of AI. If you have that view of it helping us rather than just doing something for us and taking over a job, then you can really leverage AI to be able to provide better services like you are to grow your business faster,
I appreciate your time today, Raghav. It's been amazing all the things you've shared so far. But before I let you go, I'd love to ask just one big piece of advice that you might have for other founders or CEOs just starting their business, either in the start-up phase or maybe in the growth phase. Something that you might have wished you knew a few years ago before you started is there anything you could share with us?
RAGHAV NARAYAN (23:53)
Yes, I would say more than a single advice. think it's a bunch of three advice set of advice. One of them, I think the most important thing is focus wins over speed. Try and focus very early on what are the couple of areas you want to focus. I always struggle with too many attractive options and trying to do everything. I think that's very early on we have to decide which one to focus on. Not just on one, but a couple of things, right?
Anthony Killeen (24:01)
Yeah, sure.
RAGHAV NARAYAN (24:22)
focus, focus, over, know, be a rifle rather than a shotgun, right? So that's something very important exactly. So that's something very interesting. First advice. I think the second thing would be to go and find early adopters, the early believers, and then build resilience rather than scale. Initially, if you get those things right, get it correct. And people are willing to be your loudspeakers. I think that's what is very important. So build very early adopters.
Anthony Killeen (24:26)
Yeah, yeah.
RAGHAV NARAYAN (24:45)
and build with them. I think that's the most important thing. The third one is make money. Don't you try and make money out of customers rather than from investors, right? Of course we all like to raise money but I think the whole business proposition comes only with actually making money. So try and make money, keep the cost low. Of course VCs wanted to spend money.
But I would say go and focus on earning your own money, spend less, focus on the core, get the business, start earning money from customers when it's a win-win scenario rather than just constantly raising cash and trying to make money from investors. I think those are three things I would say are critical for founders to be successful. We have a long way to go. We have just gotten across the first death trap, the million-dollar revenue, but I think the next death trap is to hit the big
Anthony Killeen (25:22)
Yeah, so.
RAGHAV NARAYAN (25:35)
million in our monthly recurring revenue, right? So that's our next focus. So yeah, but I hope you're on track. I think you're on track and really a super exciting time for me building a aprisium learning. I mean, I thought I've learned in 25 years in corporate life. Trust me, the last two years I've learned probably 10 times more in building a aprisium startup and scaling it to an area where we're now on a growth phase. So lots of learning, extremely humbling, but also extremely exciting.
Anthony Killeen (26:02)
Fantastic thanks for those insights there. That's amazing advice and really powerful for any other founders out there that are listening to that I really appreciate that For anyone out there that's that's dealing with wastewater and I thinking jeez this sounds really cool How do I get in touch with you? What's the best place to go and and line up a meeting with you?
RAGHAV NARAYAN (26:20)
LinkedIn just look for me on LinkedIn Raghav Narayan, Aprisium that's the best way just connect with me I'm very open I love meeting people connecting ideas and thoughts and people I love all that so just connect with me and we can find ways to do a win-win scenario where we can together contribute to each other's success so yeah just ping me just get in touch me on LinkedIn and then we can take it forward from there
Anthony Killeen (26:41)
Fantastic. All right, well, wherever you're listening from, I'll put the links to Rahav's LinkedIn profile and also his website. So it should be a link somewhere around the episode for you to click on. So Rahav, thanks again for joining us today. It's been absolutely amazing to learn a little bit about an industry that goes under the radar. Not many people know about. So thank you for joining us and I look forward to chatting with you again soon.
RAGHAV NARAYAN (27:03)
Thanks, Anthony. I really appreciate the opportunity. Thanks for having me. Really appreciate this whole discussion. Thank you so much.
